NIFC supporter Orli Matlow is a comedian and writer who hosts the podcast War is Stupid: An Anti-War Podcast About War. This interview is part of a series highlighting NIFC’s supporters and their stories.
What was your relationship with Israel when you were growing up?
I had a good combination of education around Israel. My formal education focused on the ‘fairytale’, but because I have family there, I knew Israel was a real place where real people live. For example, my cousins are teachers who may go on strike, and I even knew about the garbage pickup. Israel had all the problems any country did and it’s important to know the people and the nuances. I went to my cousin’s wedding in Jerusalem, which was only a formality as there’s no civic weddings, they had to get the paperwork signed in Toronto. Israel is no Disneyworld and nor should it be, but those who wield political power should wield it wisely.
How would you describe your current relationship with Israel and Israelis?
I make a point to talk to Israelis on my podcast, the premise of which is that every episode is based around a myth used to justify war. I spoke with an Israeli refusnik, Iddo Elam, and it was a really powerful conversation. He’s a 19-year-old kid who’s wiser than anyone I’ve met. Iddo was in a military prison for refusing to join the IDF. He was an activist with Palestinian friends and didn’t want to be in a position where he had to patrol his friends with machine guns. This attitude breeds resentment and violence, not safety. Israel is his country and he’s invested in its future. He’s one of the many examples of saying the status quo is unsustainable. In the diaspora we have a responsibility to uplift the voices of people on the ground, as the status quo hurts both Palestinians and Israelis. This conflict is also putting diaspora Jews in danger. We’re all invested and we all have a responsibility, whether it’s by supporting people on the ground or educating ourselves.
With a (shaky) ceasefire enabling more aid to reach Gazans and the living hostages now home, what are you feeling?
It changes every day. The initial sense was relief and I’m really grateful and happy for the families of the living hostages. However, there must be accountability for the institutions who ran cover for the war effort and claimed to speak on the hostage families’ behalf when they demanded a ceasefire for two years and even smeared ceasefire advocates. There must be accountability for the people who enabled the destruction. There is still ongoing violence and people in Gaza are saying it’s not over.
Are there times when you find it easy to discuss Israel with your family members? What do you do when there are times when you can’t?
We can agree that the bad things are bad. Issues arise around certain words like genocide or apartheid but instead of talking about vocabulary we should talk about morality. We can acknowledge that tens of thousands of deaths and starvation is immoral. Your community is humanity and there’s nothing to be ashamed of for being devastated by devastation. If people look down on you for caring for everyone, know the discomfort of disagreeing with others is nothing compared with the discomfort of actually hurting, starving, and dispossessing others.
What are the conversations you’re trying to raise through your podcast (and film)?
It’s the most basic Jewish principle in the world of asking questions. The podcast isn’t just about Israel or Gaza. I’ve spoken about the two world wars and with an Afghanistan veteran. In wartime there’s a “rally around the flag” effect. Looking at history, people make the same mistakes over and over again when brute force is seen as a way of resolving conflicts — but it only sows the seeds for future wars. So ask questions. There are real human lives behind the sloganeering. If you wear a dog tag and wave an Israeli flag, you have a responsibility to ask questions.
Why did you choose to support NIFC? What aspect of NIFC’s work inspires you the most?
NIFC’s funded partners supporting human and civil rights and people on the ground is crucial. This Israeli government is an obstacle for peace and safety for Jews around the world. It’s important to support civil society and NGOs that are working to build a more equitable world.
What is the one key message you want young Canadian Jews to understand regarding the current situation in Israel?
Israel is a real place with real problems and to treat it like Narnia or Hogwarts does a disservice to the people who actually live there, and must deal with its issues. Israel has everything a real country entails and to treat it as a mythical place is unfair to both Israelis and Palestinians.
You can watch the most recent episode of War is Stupid: An Anti-War Podcast About War below: